I have twice written about the problems between Amigos Restaurant and neighbors. In the past I have tried to be objective and neutral, this time I am going to be subjective and biased.
When I first wrote about the noise complaint made by a group of local residents, I had great sympathy for them. They filed a proper complaint with MINSA the agency responsible for enforcing the noise ordinances on Dec 13 2011. They also caused a stir at a Meeting of the Junta Communal (think City Council).
Upon further investigation it appears the group is really a small handful of people and two of them then initiated a Criminal Complaint against the legal representative and administrator of Amigos Restaurant. The complaint is real, I have a copy. It is dated December 28 2011, about two weeks after the civil and correct complaint to MINSA . MINSA the Ministry of Health had 45 days, by law, to resolve the problem. The criminal complaint cites environmental laws designed for catastrophic destruction not noise from a band; in my opinion it is worse than a sham, it is abuse of the legal system.
Since the December 13 complaint Amigos management has worked with MINSA to find a solution to satisfy the complainants. They have ordered a movable sound barrier which has not yet arrived. They start their music early, 5pm and end it at 8PM. They reduced the volume have made great effort to resolve the problem. None of this has calmed one vociferous complainant.
We all just experience the January Coffee and Flower Fair, I heard the music several kilometers from town with a mountain between me and the fair grounds. The noise from Amigos does not even come close to the noise from the fair. I was there last night and the noise from passing cars and a motorcycle were louder than the noise in the the bar.
One person, an expat, who is causing this stir has now returned to MINSA complaining again. Now his demands are that MINSA take further action despite all of the things already done to resolve his problem. It has even been said that he complained that both Mark the manager and Sam, the lawyer for Amigos, need to get haircuts; I do remember being told than in 1969 too. He has also called on certain groups to boycott Amigos.
Amigos Boquete Panama
Amigos Restaurant is a significant part of the Boquete community. Many times in it’s first incarnation it provided the only real center for music and celebration in the early developing expat community. Now, in it’s new location it is fighting to survive. Mark and Jennifer invested heavily in renovating a decaying building. They hired and trained many local residents for jobs and now they find themselves having to pay a lawyer to help them stay open and out of jail. They would never, ever, say what I am going to say here.
I read an article about how a small town in New England rallied to help keep a local hardware store open by asking local residents to please go to the hardware store and spend $20. It worked, the store was mobbed by people who voted with their dollars and provided the blood, cash, the store needed.
I have no knowledge of the finances of Amigos, Mark or Jennifer but I do know that they opened a short time ago and have been fighting to stay open from the beginning. Their life blood is people coming to party, live music and now in an effort to placate their neighbor they have had to curtail their major source of revenue. We the community should support Amigos and let them make the modifications MINSA has agreed will satisfy the noise issue.
My request to you, is a counter boycott, if one complainant can ask people to throttle a business by boycott I can ask you do the opposite. If indeed the pen is mightier than the sword, I declare the week starting tomorrow Jan 30, Amigos Appreciation Week. I asking you to visit Amigos this week, have breakfast, lunch or dinner or just have drink. Let them know you appreciate that they are a part of Boquete and that you support them. If you have never been to the new Amigos drive from downtown Boquete to the new library and turn left at the bus garage, it will be directly in front of you.
I’m onto it!
CU @ Amigos!!
Mark needs a haircut?
The complaining expat needs a psychiatrist!
I once talked to the owners of the old Amigos, expressing interest in a purchase. Just curious, what happened to the old building with the apartments upstairs? Greg in Florida
When their lease expired the entire building, Hostel next door and want was Amigos was leased to another group.
The bus garage is on the main road into town just across from the new three story library building.
I will be there and I know my wife Robyn frequents the place for a salad at lunch. Hang in there, Mark and Jennifer.
Unbelievable story. Great idea Lee. I have not been up to Boquete for a while. I will make it a point to round up a car full of my friends and we will make a trip to Amigos this week.
I’ll bet anything that these people, were they lived previously in the U.S., were known for complaining to the Home Owners’ Association about the guy down the street not taking care of his lawn or the shutters on the house across the street needing painting. And you can’t shoot them or you would be charged with wasting a perfectly good bullet. Ha…
It boggles the mind to think that someone would be foolish enough to make themself the pariah of a small and tightly-knit expat community. Stupid over-reaction and everyone pays a price for it. What a shame!
Under the category of “Be careful what you wish for”, and with the understanding that I’m not a resident there (yet), I wish to mention that it would be strategic for Amigos to remember that defense doesn’t usually put points on the board, and if I were the Amigos, I would be looking for weakness in the opposition. It appears to me that Amiogos is going out of their way to comply and be a welcomed member of the community, while others are bent on moving them out. I would start looking for two things: 1) What is the real beef these complainers have – what or who is behind it, and 2) How do I make life miserable for the enemy?
I like a few beers now and then, and I play guitar and make a little noise now and then, too. I also like going out to eat and I tned to forget my manners when things become unreasonable. I would look to my supporters. Gee, it would be a shame if certain groups or certain people could no longer buy a drink, get an appointment for a gardner, or to have their hair done… You see where I’m going.
You said it right earlier – “a close-knit group”. Somebody has stepped out of line; forgotten their place, and need to be put back into it.
But, I’m just a wannabe outsider…
Under the category of “Be careful what you wish for”, and with the understanding that I’m not a resident there (yet), I wish to mention that it would be strategic for Amigos to remember that defense doesn’t usually put points on the board, and if I were the Amigos, I would be looking for weakness in the opposition. It appears to me that Amigos is going out of their way to comply and be a welcomed member of the community, while others are bent on moving them out. I would start looking for two things: 1) What is the real beef these complainers have – what or who is behind it, and 2) How do I make life miserable for the enemy?
I like a few beers now and then, and I play guitar and make a little noise now and then, too. I also like going out to eat and I tned to forget my manners when things become unreasonable. I would look to my supporters. Gee, it would be a shame if certain groups or certain people could no longer buy a drink, get an appointment for a gardner, or to have their hair done… You see where I’m going.
You said it right earlier – “a close-knit group”. Somebody has stepped out of line; forgotten their place, and need to be put back into it.
But, I’m just a wannabe outsider…
So how loud is it during zumba at the bitcher’s wife’s business, Curvas Bonitas? Just sayin!
talk about one bad apple…! it is ridiculous that a fellow expat, whose wife owns a gringo patronized workout center, would say to “boycott” a business. what if everyone decided to “boycott” Curves? i am sure the neighbor would be outraged.
as has been pointed out by several readers and concurred with by many of us, this is a very close-knit community. i’m sure if next week, the first of the month when you are supposed to pay your fee for the gym, if the Amigo’s supporters didnt attend for a week, the message might get through.
as far as some comments about drink prices, discount or no, food and service uneven, that is not the point. the point is, mark and jennifer have every much a right to make a living as does any other business owner. music from 5pm to 8pm? and that is offending someone? it doesn’t seem reasonable to me. lets not even bring up the “haircut” remark. someone needs a reality check.
What events at Amigos have been curtailed, Lee? They might be starting and stopping the live music a little earlier some evenings, but that timing better suits many of their geriatric patrons, myself included. Open Mic night on Thursdays, which is a real blast btw, runs later, as you know. I’m glad to hear Mark is being proactive with the attenuation. IMHO, the place really does need baffles of some type because of the relatively low ceiling and tile floors. I’m a regular patron and will try to increase my coffee intake this week.
Specifically they had to eliminate music this past Saturday. In addition the new complaint includes not only bands but also open mic on Thursday nights. They have purchased sound reduction materials and are awaiting for them to arrive, they are working to resolve the problem. The current solution is lower volumes, earlier end times and elimination of some music.
The owner of Curvas Bonita is NOT involved with the noise dispute between Amigos and the neighborhood. It’s unfair to implicate / involve her. Marital partners don’t always vote the same, eat the same food, or fight the same fights. Lee, you’re doing a great job of “Let’s you and he fight!” Must be good for readership… I’m an Amigos customer—was there a few nights ago. But things didn’t end at 8 pm. They started then. I enjoy Amigos as much as the next person and will continue to patronize. But to be honest, I’m glad I don’t live near them. They are the newcomer to the neighborhood, not the other way around. The community needs to stay out of the fray and let the parties & agencies involved work things out.
Dear Charlotte
I wrote an earlier post to inform people and hoped this situation would be resolved amicably. I spoke to those affected on both sides. MINSA has this under control and they are the legal authority. Then a Criminal complaint was filed, by two people, that complaint puts people at risk of arrest and is costing them hard dollars for defense.
Then after great efforts for compliance another complaint filed last week. Following your logic the two people who instigated a criminal complaint should allow MINSA the correct agency the time to do their job and not escalate this beyond what it is, a noise issue.
I intentionally omitted names from the post but because Bonnie’s name has come up, I will state she is not one of the people who signed the Criminal Complaint and I agree that she should not be dragged into this matter.
Lee-
How do those of us who live outside the area most of the year make a contribution to Amigo’s to ensure that when we do visit, it’s there for us to enjoy? I’d like to vote my dollars from a far in support of Amigo’s, I’ve enjoyed the previous incarnations and most definitely want to enjoy this new one !!
Lee,
How does MINSA control matters? By determining an acceptable noise level? What if MINSA compliance isn’t attained? Waiting for attenuation equipment to arrive isn’t an excuse to maintain status quo. When I was at Amigos on Friday night, I was unable to speak to the person sitting next to me without yelling because of loud live music. It started at 8 pm. The band was on the far side of the room, which essentially is right under a residential property. I enjoyed the music and loudness—that’s what I went for. But if I’d been in my home and wanted to sleep or watch TV fifty meters away, it would have been disturbing. Moreover, if I were subjected to the same noise level, 3-4 days a week, I’d probably find it hard to be patient on a promise that things might get better if/when more barriers arrived. Without the specifics, all one can do is conjecture…My point is that I disagree with instigating the community to take sides. I personally can’t. I don’t think shunning any set of individuals is going to resolve the matter. Nor is community support for the business owners going to keep a non-compliant establishment above the law. I am staying out of it and letting the authorities resolve the issue. I appreciate your coming to Bonnie’s defense regarding the criminal complaint.
I am not a big fan of Amigos. Only go there durring daylight hours. The food ,and the service has alot to be desierd. I have heard that the food and the service is much better at night. As far as the noise issue.. Try living near the Santa Lucia Country Club. They sometimes have music as late as 5 am. It is so loud that I can not hear my T V. (with the doors and windows closed.) I don’t hear any complaints about that.
From what I understand, Mark and Jennifer have made a substantail investment in the new Amigos. Please, give them a chance.
One more note to Mark…. Budweiser bottles are not an imported beer. They cost apprx one dollar more than Balboa or Panama, per case. When you run specials, such as Tuesdays, Bud should be included.
Budweiser Steve.
This has some resemblance to the situations in which people buy houses under the flight path of planes taking off and landing at an airport and then begin filing noise complaints. The building where Amigos is now located has been there a long time and before “the complainant” bought his house. The building was a disco club and played louder music much later into the night, if I understand correctly. The location was licensed for such activities. It would not have been reasonable to anticipate that a new tenant would make the place into a convent.
I believe this is a case of fixation on a rather minor problem until it has grown into a one-sided feud.. Sound attenuation works both ways. It may be possible to do something clever like closing a couple of windows. I have a neighbor with a dog that whines and barks a good percentage of the time. I don’t especially like it, but neighbors need to have a reasonable degree of tolerance.
Wasn’t this building a local “NIGHT CLUB” long before Amigos took it over? Seems to me that the building and its location in the community was established LONG before the complaint. This is not a new use for this building. This is a continued use for this building which Mark and Jennifer got permission from the government to continue. Seems clear cut to me. If I lived near a church I wouldn’t be surprised if a new minister took it over….
Let’s use some common sense people.
Charlotte,
The law the regulates sound is a health law. The Statute which allows for a fine not jail time is administered by MINSA. As of this time MINSA has asked the to lower the sound levels and each time I have been in Amigos, clearly not the night you attended, it has not been load. I agree with you this should have been resolved by MINSA and Amigos and they are working together to resolve it. While they were working together criminal charges were brought under an environmental protection law, then additional complains were made, not by a large group of neighbors but by two people. If they had let MINSA do it’s job the reduction the reduction in sound would happen since all barrier material were ordered and are in route.
I am not asking anyone to shun anyone, one person asked people to shun Amigos, I am asking people to Support Amigos by going and eating or having a drink there. I do not see any attack on any individual in my request. People are entitled to be informed and they can reach their own conclusions, you included.
They could simply resolve the problem by instating a local noise ordinance. There is no need to put up with loud music all night long. I’ve lived near the stadium in Boquete and it used to be unbearable especially during New Years
very interesting discussion…..in the first post i read about this ,it sounded like Amigos moved in next to the complainant…but abv. i`ve read twice that this was earlier a club with music…if thats true ,then i do not understand the complaint…you can ask to lower the noise, but “when you move out to the country ,you might expect farm animals”…this sounds very much like a firends struggle ,they did win after a long battle.
They own an old (160 yr old) farm in Michigan…they have always had a chicken coop, they sell eggs…
the city next door grew ,houses got built right next to theuir farm , neighbors started to complain about the chickens and wanted to shut down my friends egg business…$50,000 later they did win.
when you buy a house next to a farm ,expect farm animals , if its next to a night club ,expect music.
HELP!! I’m turning into my parents!
I am going to attempt to make an important distinction and explain to some why I am agressive about this issue. First I do not have a financial interest in Amigos. Next, I consider all the parties friends, those who own the bar and the two people who’s names have come up from other comments as complainants. Third this is not about noise.
I wrote about the noise issue December 31,link here. I ended with this statement:
“MINSA is your correct legal solution, the drama with the Mayor was un-necessary since he has no legal authority, the criminal charges just wrong. I accept the possibility as so often happens with lawyers and things lost in translation you did not understand what the lawyer did in your name. If this is to be resolved. sit down with Juan Pablo from MINSA and Mark and come to an acceptable solution to all.”
When I received a copy of the Criminal complaint I read it, I asked questions about it and wondered why use a sledge hammer to resolve a problem that was already in the process of being resolved. I still cannot answer that question but I am concerned about the abuse of the legal system to intimidate businesses. If this succeeds it does because it a game of who can financially outlast the other, not about who is right or wrong.
MINSA is resolving the noise issue, my issue is abuse of law not noise. My encouragement is for people to spend some money in a local establishment to help them stay in business, not so they can prevent a neighbor from sleeping, they are resolving that with the appropriate government agency.
According to you, the criminal complaint was filed on Dec. 28th , a month ago. Also according to your previous post, resolution of the problem was due within 30 days. That 30 days is likely coming to a close. My understanding of your current post is that another Criminal Complaint wasn’t filed, but additional complaints re: noise were lodged. Is that right? If so, there seems to be an ongoing noise issue. If the criminal complaint is inappropriate and an abuse of the law, why hasn’t the receiving legal entity rejected the filing? I also have to ask why the business owners, forewarned of potential for a noise dispute prior to opening, didn’t apply some of their substantial initial investment toward noise attenuation? Having not done so, why proceed with events guaranteed to aggravate discord? I’ve been told noise was a reason the business was moved out of its prior location. Don’t know if it’s true, but Restaurant Baru doesn’t seem to schedule noisemaking events….That said, I enjoy Amigos and wish the business well. I’m glad I don’t live in their neighborhood.
As a soon to be resident, please consider this note as a virtual toast to Los Amigos:
Hang in there, guys! Don’t give up the ship? Anything worth having is worth fighting for. Hopefully there’s enough fair and free-thinking “amigos de Los Amigos” to “circle the wagons” till the shooting’ subsides. Sounds like General “Lee” has sounded the bugle t rally the troops.
Sure hope you’re still alive and thrivin’ by the time we make the move. If so, you can count on two Texans to be regulars. Good luck and best wishes for a victory over aggrivatin’, aggitatin’ whinin’ folks who insist on makin’ things hard on folks who seem to be tryin’ to be good neighbors.
“Here’s to Los Amigos!”. “SALUD!”
Ed,
First beer is on me! Welcome to Boquete!!
I will certainly check ot the noise level in mid/late March when I visit Boquete for my third time…..
I’m very sure that the issues are something deeper than “NOISE”. As far as I know the cause of the first Amigo’s moving was “the noise” and now there’s a new business making “more noise” in the old building and nobody complains about “the noise” (and is not nice music – fact). Now, they got a new building and there’s again “the noise” in a building that used to be a disco bar before they took it and frecuented by people let’s say not the best kind of costumers, really bad sound system and the loud particular panamanian music (the one were the singers dont sing, they scream with a guittar), never knew about “noise issues”. But to compliment this thought, isn’t this the same what hapened to Culturas a few months ago, the “noise issue”? Seems to me that there’s a big thing going on with “the noise” gringos, foreigners or similar business bars-restaurants make. There’s definitaly something going on with people in Boquete. Once I heard “Man is the only animal that kills each other by evil”. I have no interest in any part involved on this, it’s just a very outsider opinion that makes me wonder why is it always a business with not panamanian owners.
I think instead of noise there’s more important thing’s to considerate about the town to be worried, for example, every single fair, carnival, PH or any other activity/parade have anyone noticed how dirty the town turns and how many days it takes to the garbage people clean the mess? or the indian fight club going on the romero street every single week from thursdays – sundays? the town water problems, broken pipes or not well mantained roads (as many paople i was a victim of a big sewer without top located in the new bus stop)?
All I asked is how loud is the music during zumba at Curvas? Can you hear it when you’re eating chicken at the adjacent restaurant?
aardvark, you’re trying really REALLY hard to get Curvas into the situation. Why? What is YOUR agenda in this?
It’s been made clear, more than once, that Curvas is not part of the issue. Try to follow the realities.
Let’s see. How many different venues have been mentioned during these discussions regarding music being played at various levels around Boquete. Amigos, Baru, Culturas, the fairgrounds and maybe more. Curvas is a venue that plays music at some level. Is it acceptable? Just asking.
Loud music from Amigos, Baru, Culturas and the fairgrounds goes on late into the night. Curvas does not play loud music every day and certainly not late into the night. Can you understand the difference… or does your pigheaded determination to involve Curvas prevent logic from from your thought process? Yes, I get that you probably have a financial affiliation with Amigos and have a “Payton Place” brain, but GIVE IT UP.
those angry gringos should go home…far away from panama
It never seems to take long to escalate to the insults. First, I have never been to the new Amigos but will get there at some point. Second, What is Payton Place? Is that Walter Payton’s place? Or Peyton Place, which could certainly describe Boquete. Third, give it up? Because you say so? Who appointed you Commander of the Universe?